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Old 10-11-2015, 10:55 AM   #1
maggy
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Question Pymatuning Creek Questions - Ghaulie Rd?

Hello from a noob,

I hope this the place to ask a question about the trails that are posted.
My question is about the Pymatunin Creek Trail.
http://www.trumbullcanoetrails.org/i...ymatuningcreek

We've been scouting and can't figure out where Ghaulie Rd Bridge is located.
We found a state game lands access road at Job-Greenville Rd. There are access roads on both the Ohio and PA side. We found 2 old bridge foundations pretty far into the woods entering from Rt 7 Is that the right location or is there somewhere along Rt 7 that we are overlooking?

So far, looking at the creek from different locations it seems the creek has a lot of tree blockage but it might be fun to try.

Does anyone here have experience with the creek going from Kinsman to Orangeville?

Thanks in advance for any help.
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Old 10-11-2015, 07:34 PM   #2
KenM
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Default A bit of info

It sounds like the area you are asking about is the Pymatuning Creek which flows through the Shenango Wildlife Area in Ohio. Map can be found at

http://wildlife.ohiodnr.gov/Portals/...s/shenango.pdf

I am not familiar with the Ghaulie Rd Bridge either and can't find it on my maps.

My personal experience with Pymatuning Creek is June 2014 Cheryl and I put in at Milligan Rd bridge. We were able to paddle upstream .5 mile before log jams.and downstream .5 mile til stopped by logs. Gage was 4.75 ft.

In July 2013 we paddled upstream from Orangeville about 3 miles. This was a fairly wild area and we saw many birds.

From a couple of other scouting trips I can't imagine paddling from Kinsman because the creek is full of logs. I have heard of it being done but maybe at some high water level ??

There are others in this club that probably known more about this creek. This forum is not always highly active but the club itself is very active. Please consider joining TCT. It has a lot of friendly paddlers that will help you get started.

- Ken
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Old 10-11-2015, 09:13 PM   #3
JPTolson
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Hello from a noob,

So far, looking at the creek from different locations it seems the creek has a lot of tree blockage but it might be fun to try.

Thanks in advance for any help.
My only occasions on Pymatuning Creek were in 2009 and 2010 with the club, both times putting in at Andy Dorick Park in Orangeville and paddling up several miles and back and once paddling down to Shenango Lake from below the dam and back. So I do not know the current situation with regard to trees across the creek. But if, from your scouting, you can see a lot of tree blockage, be wary of committing yourself to a downriver run without knowing the full extent of the blockage situation. If there are many that you can see, chances are there will be others in areas that you can't see from a road.

Getting around blockages can be difficult for a couple reasons–steep and/or slippery banks on either side of the creek, debris-filled jams that require hacking your way through, slippery logs well above the water level in the creek that you have to climb up and over with your boat, and poison ivy-covered logs. Doing this a couple times on a trip may not be a big deal, but if there are many blockages, it will sear the trip permanently in your memory and could significantly lengthen the time it takes to reach the take out. If you're new to the sport, better to try to get on a club trip where chances are that you will not encounter a situation with lots of obstacles.
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Old 10-12-2015, 07:18 AM   #4
swampboy62
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I paddled Pymatuning Creek quite a bit when I first started kayaking.

We mostly started from Milligan Road, but one time put in up at route 88. Never heard of Ghaulie Road either.

We used to paddle from Milligan to Orangeville with no problem, but there was actually somebody keeping the creek open back then - it might have been the people from the marina in Orangeville that rented kayaks. With no one to cut out downed trees I can imagine that it wouldn't take long before the blockages became a problem.

And it's not always going to be easy to get around them either because of the nature of the creek. With a mud bottom and banks it can be difficult to even find a place to get out of the creek. And many areas of the creek have sloughs off to the side that stay really marshy and soft - again not great for portaging.

We used to paddle upstream a ways from Milligan, dodging the downed trees, to a swamp on the east side of the creek where we could see a bald eagle nest from the water. Always saw a lot of turkeys back there too.

Steve Z
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Old 10-12-2015, 09:54 PM   #5
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Default Thank You!

Thanks JPTolson
It does look rugged just from the few places we can get a view!

We might chance part of it ... Thank you swampboy62 Milligan onward... maybe we won't see too much blockage!

I do have that map KenM... It shows the creek going far north of where we've scouted into Williamsfield... nice!

Thank you all very much for your input! WOW!

We have paddled upstream from the Shenango reservoir into Orangevllle (Andy Dorick Park ) and back but that is the extent of it.

We have enjoyed our Shenango wilderness area scouting trips though ... searching for the elusive Ghaulie Road.

We are definitely planning to send in a registration application form.

Thank you all very much for your valuable information!
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Old 10-13-2015, 07:36 AM   #6
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Another paddling opportunity in that area would be to get on the creek just on the other side of the state line and paddle out into the western reaches of Shenango Reservoir.

There is an old dead end road off of Carlisle Road (it's labeled 'Old Carlisle Road' on Google maps) that leads down to the creek on the downstream side of the dam. From there it's easy to put on the creek and paddle down a short distance into the reservoir. There are a bunch of inlets and bays to explore on the far west end, just make sure you're paying attention to where you came from so you can find your way back!

You might want to also look into French Creek, leading into the Allegheny R. at Franklin. It's close by and a mild run, but I'm not sure of public river access points - it might take some exploring.

Steve Z
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Old 10-13-2015, 11:49 AM   #7
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You might want to also look into French Creek, leading into the Allegheny R. at Franklin. It's close by and a mild run, but I'm not sure of public river access points - it might take some exploring.

Steve Z
There is a grassy public access site on French Creek at Utica, PA, on river left that TCT uses as a put in for its annual trip on French Creek. Take out is on the Allegheny at the Elk Street? boat ramp on river right.
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Old 10-15-2015, 08:06 AM   #8
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Quote:
Another paddling opportunity in that area would be to get on the creek just on the other side of the state line and paddle out into the western reaches of Shenango Reservoir.
Yes! While paddling, we wondered if there was a road that came near the creek and I googled that area after we went upstream to the Orangeville damn and back. It was Old Carlisle. We launched at Parker's Landing and went into the western part of Shenango just to find the creek. And as you've noted it was a maze but at a point we noticed someone had hung bright pink survey streamers from the trees. They followed the trail so we figured they were breadcrumbs, not sure. There might be another reason for streamers that we are just too green to understand. We enjoyed that area immensely. As you say, lots of wildlife... loved seeing many turtles basking on the branches and apparently all the herons that were in the old heron sanctuary live there now. And about losing our way - I take my cell and use mapmyrun. It helps us get back to start point since we also like to kayak at night. I can also look at the map later and see where roads are in relation to our trips. Google is usually correct but not always. We also searched for historical maps of the lake since we wanted to identify the old roadway going across the lake in that area. I need to take better notes since I can't remember the name of it but it comes off of Saranac. It's now a primitive access area with steps going down to the lake. The road is now a trail that ends in the lake.

Quote:
There is a grassy public access site on French Creek at Utica, PA, on river left that TCT uses as a put in for its annual trip on French Creek. Take out is on the Allegheny at the Elk Street? boat ramp on river right.
We are thinking of trying French creek from Saegertown to Meadville. Is that too advanced for beginners? I've been reading about it on the French Creek Trail site. We'll definitely scout before attempting it.

Thank you both very much!
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Old 10-15-2015, 12:36 PM   #9
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For checking out old, abandoned roads you might check out USGS maps. Sometimes they show roads that are gone with dotted lines.

One of the map sites I use for researching creeks & trails is hillmaps. The nice thing about this site is that it allows you to pan across USGS maps, and also allows you to compare two different maps at once. For example, if you look south of Kinsman on the USGS map you can see an unlabeled abandoned road that comes out at Allen Corners on the east side of Pyamatuning Creek. Not sure but that might be the missing Ghaulie Road. Looking at the same place on the Google maps streetview you can see a nice straight drive going back beside a corn field there that likely was the old road.

http://www.hillmap.com/

Use the 'Caltopo' option for what seems to be the clearest USGS maps.

Steve Z
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Old 10-15-2015, 01:03 PM   #10
KenM
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Default Good Maps !

Hey Steve, thanks for posting link to Hillmaps. I usually bounce between my Delorme Topo program and Google Maps plus other stuff. I was not aware of Hillmaps but it looks promising. I will be exploring it's capabilities.

-KenM

Now to locate the mystery Ghaulie Road !!
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